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Discussion Starter #1
Did another log and my suspicion was right. 1st gear rpm peaks at 6400rpms and as it shifts to 2nd, the rpms drops to 5460rpms. At the 1-2 shift, boost is at 14.5psi. Peak rpm in 2nd goes to 6260rpms and right when it shifts into 3rd, the rpms fall off all the way down to 4800, but boost stays at 17.5
Not sure if its due to the gearing or if the tranny takes longer to engage thus dropping the rpms, but its kinda odd that it holds the boost on the 2-3 shift.
 

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Can you run another log and record spark/timing?
For years now manufacturers cut spark for a millisecond during shifts to smooth them out.
I wonder if that's the case here, maybe it's cut longer for longevity?
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Can you run another log and record spark/timing?
For years now manufacturers cut spark for a millisecond during shifts to smooth them out.
I wonder if that's the case here, maybe it's cut longer for longevity?
I have it in my log and I can check when I get home. I know afr was good at 11.7 and lamda stayed low at .84
 

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I'd really like to see a full built-up monster with a rebuilt transmission, that eliminates this 3rd gear issue, PTU upgrades, driveshaft / halfshaft upgrades, and the rest... Would be interesting to see 600HP out of one of these.
600 HP Fusion, say no more... That would redefine the term Sleeper
 

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The question when considering a 600 HP full drivetrain rebuild is: why? Other than for the novelty of it is there a reason? Is the CD4 chassis so good that it can handle or deserve a race drivetrain?

Don't get me wrong. I'd love to have a monster. If there was a shop nearby with the expertise, I'd absolutely investigate what it would take to drive a monster. I'm young and dumb enough to give up the luxuries of life to be able to daily drive that monster. But at some point you have to stop and think, "why not just buy a Hellcat?"
 

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Discussion Starter #7
The question when considering a 600 HP full drivetrain rebuild is: why? Other than for the novelty of it is there a reason? Is the CD4 chassis so good that it can handle or deserve a race drivetrain?

Don't get me wrong. I'd love to have a monster. If there was a shop nearby with the expertise, I'd absolutely investigate what it would take to drive a monster. I'm young and dumb enough to give up the luxuries of life to be able to daily drive that monster. But at some point you have to stop and think, "why not just buy a Hellcat?"
The amount of parts and fabrication would run close to what the car cost. Total price for 600HP would be in the 50 to 60 range. I found several used Hellcats in the 48 to 50 range, so yeah Id go the Hellcat route. On the other hand, I spent 8k in mods on my mustang and it was around 690HP out of the motor or 600 to the wheels. You think this cars power brings a smile to your face, you should have driven my mustang.
 

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Funny you bring up the Hellcat - I looked into leasing on from a local dealership that had an awesome lease deal, but my insurance company killed that idea. They quoted about 2700 a year to add it to my policy. A Raptor? Around $300.

The lease, plus tires and insurance just added up to too much.

I figure, given a year or two, we'll probably see guys with right about 400 HP at the wheels. That's plenty of performance to satisfy me and a solid sleeper. A 600 HP car woud be awesome, but I think I would start with another platform if I felt the urge to spend what it would take.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Are you meaning the bog shortly after the 2-3 shift or the shift itself. I have noticed that my 1-2 shift feels stronger than subsequent shifts but it's the bog after the 2-3 that bugs me. I will say that with the tune, the more throttle the less you notice it. This condition has been referred to by my bud at LME and otheIrs as the TC locking up. It feels kinda like two half shifts.
Yes, bog, lag or slush shift. Lol. Thanks for sharing the info and now I know. Not sure If a tune can do much for the lock up.
 

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Are you meaning the bog shortly after the 2-3 shift or the shift itself. I have noticed that my 1-2 shift feels stronger than subsequent shifts but it's the bog after the 2-3 that bugs me. I will say that with the tune, the more throttle the less you notice it. This condition has been referred to by my bud at LME and others as the TC locking up. It feels kinda like two half shifts.
It still does this even with the tune? I tell you this is a low 13 sec. car right from the showroom floor if it had a worthy tranny. I know Ford is coming out with some new transmissions and I pray it comes out for the FFS. For anyone who hasn't gotten to drive a new BMW 3 series with the 8spd. auto, go take a test drive in a BMW 330i or 340i with the 8spd. auto that comes with this car. Shifts are firm, they are at redline and they are almost as quick as a DCT. Worth an easy .5 second in the 1/4 mile. The engine is a gem in these cars, but once again its the tranny holding them back.
 

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Shift Speeds from the Service Manual. Thought it might be interesting. I remember a previous discussion, about wishing we could get to 60 in second gear. Manual seems to think it's possible.

There's also a bit about the Torque Converter Clutch. It looks like it shouldn't come into effect until 4th gear.

Code:
Throttle Position  Range  Shift  KM/H     MPH  
Light Throttle     D      1-2    14-19    9-12  
                   D      2-3    24-31    15-19  
                   D      3-4    32-40    20-25  
                   D      4-5    45-56    28-35  
                   D      5-6    63-80    39-50  

Medium Throttle    D      1-2    37-47    23-29  
                   D      2-3    58-71    36-44  
                   D      3-4    74-93    46-58  
                   D      4-5    108-135  67-84  
                   D      5-6    169-211  105-131  

Heavy Throttle     D      1-2    55-69    34-43  
                   D      2-3    84-105   52-65  
                   D      3-4    127-158  79-98  
                   D      4-5    167-208  104-129  
                   D      5-6    179-222  111-138
 

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Shift Speeds from the Service Manual. Thought it might be interesting. I remember a previous discussion, about wishing we could get to 60 in second gear. Manual seems to think it's possible.

There's also a bit about the Torque Converter Clutch. It looks like it shouldn't come into effect until 4th gear.

Code:
Throttle Position  Range  Shift  KM/H     MPH  
Light Throttle     D      1-2    14-19    9-12  
                   D      2-3    24-31    15-19  
                   D      3-4    32-40    20-25  
                   D      4-5    45-56    28-35  
                   D      5-6    63-80    39-50  

Medium Throttle    D      1-2    37-47    23-29  
                   D      2-3    58-71    36-44  
                   D      3-4    74-93    46-58  
                   D      4-5    108-135  67-84  
                   D      5-6    169-211  105-131  

Heavy Throttle     D      1-2    55-69    34-43  
                   D      2-3    84-105   52-65  
                   D      3-4    127-158  79-98  
                   D      4-5    167-208  104-129  
                   D      5-6    179-222  111-138


I really wish that it would make it to 100km/h. I find that it loses close to .5 seconds in the 0-60 because of that 3rd gear shift and lag.
 

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Mustang... Hellcat...

What about the AWD advantage of the Fusion?
 

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Historically torque converters aren't supposed to lock up until cruising speed, or the load on the engine is decreased.
If it is the converter locking up under WOT I have to believe it going to be prone to failure.
This is the first I've ever heard of this.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Historically torque converters aren't supposed to lock up until cruising speed, or the load on the engine is decreased.
If it is the converter locking up under WOT I have to believe it going to be prone to failure.
This is the first I've ever heard of this.
Ive been monitoring my tranny temps and they seem to hover around 197* during hard runs. My mustang always stayed around 207* so at least temps arent going to be an issue with Sport.
 

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Historically torque converters aren't supposed to lock up until cruising speed, or the load on the engine is decreased.
If it is the converter locking up under WOT I have to believe it going to be prone to failure.
This is the first I've ever heard of this.
All Fords recently with a 6spd auto do this. The Sport is just most noticeable. I had a '14 and now '16 Escape 2.0, they both do it. My parent's '15 Fusion 1.5 does it. My family's '13 Edge 3.5L does it. And I drive a '16 3.7L Explorer and '15 TransitConnect 2.5L that all do it since new. Like I said the Fusion Sport is just way more noticeable, but they all do it if you look for it.
 

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I talked to my tuner to see if it was possible to increase the TC speed ratio in second to bring the speed up before it shifts to second to see if that helps even the gear ratios out, but he haven't got back to me on that yet. Still working out some other issues atm.

The TC lockup doesn't affect the acceleration, fyi. The "bog" happens pretty much at peak torque, so acceleration is not hurt by it. At least it doesn't appear to be judging by the speed line on my log. A vbox G log might tell a different story, but I doubt it.
 
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