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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Found this video on YouTube while watching Ecoboosted's exhaust clip. It was made in response to a Subaru owners Internet claim that we have a slip in grip type of AWD. Hopefully this link works.

 

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Lol funny video.
 

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The original Car and Driver online review made the same erroneous claim. It mysteriously disappeared by the time it went to print.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Well I would love to have his explanation of the system from the Ford engineer that he claimed at the end of the video. And technically his video does not prove we don't have a slip n grip AWD system by definition. It could still be just responding to slippage, just extremely quickly. And I don't think that is a bad thing. Now that being said, the AWD graphic on the dash really makes it seem that it responds to throtte input, but that's just a graphical representation and possible gimmick. I personally think it's a combination of factors that controls where power is being sent including slippage. The complete absence of torque steer is not due to a system that is redirecting power(~400lbs tuned) purely upon wheel slippage. No we don't have the sweet RS AWD system or Subaru's system, but it's much better than many AWD systems out there.
 

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A lot of folks want to hate on the sport cause its the best car all round for the price.. The AWD is defiantly not a low end application at all.. it kicks in when the computer thinks it is needed and that is not just under slip fact.
 

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Well I would love to have his explanation of the system from the Ford engineer that he claimed at the end of the video. And technically his video does not prove we don't have a slip n grip AWD system by definition. It could still be just responding to slippage, just extremely quickly. And I don't think that is a bad thing. Now that being said, the AWD graphic on the dash really makes it seem that it responds to throtte input, but that's just a graphical representation and possible gimmick. I personally think it's a combination of factors that controls where power is being sent including slippage. The complete absence of torque steer is not due to a system that is redirecting power(~400lbs tuned) purely upon wheel slippage. No we don't have the sweet RS AWD system or Subaru's system, but it's much better than many AWD systems out there.
I agree, it does not prove or disprove anything...
BUT:
On dry pavement, it does not slip as far as the ear can tell. It just goes, and quickly too...
In the snow (almost bottoming out the car snow), I can't tell if it slips or not. I can tell you goes there too and really well...
Whether it detects slippage and engages in a few milliseconds (maybe 16 to 17ms), or the computer engages it based on the throttle and a combination of things really does not matter to me in any way...

If you can tell the difference between instant (0.000 seconds) and a few milliseconds (0.017 seconds) without sophisticated measurement equipment, you may be an ultra sensitive person???
 
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Software mod opp!

...it kicks in when the computer thinks it is needed and that is not just under slip fact.
This is on topic, but takes a bit to explain. Artificial intelligence software is everywhere. AI "savants" (one with specialized knowledge and/or skills) range from skill centric to "big data" centric. Sometimes an AI savant is "subsumed" by other savants. End point here? The "tipping points" for one behavior to replace another can be adjusted under software! So with engine, braking, front/rear allocation under software control, aftermarket tuners have a whole new market for software upgrades besides "only" engine. OMG, I love the 21st century!:)
 
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One thing that points away from a purely reactive AWD application (i.e. that torque is sent to the rear only when the front wheels experience slipping) is that it WILL oversteer under the right conditions. Turn off the traction control, head into an icy or snowy corner at low speed and hit the gas when the car is mid-turn and the back will kick out slightly.

I believe it is a form of Haldex system, which means a clutch pack is under the control of the computer, so not a true limited slip diff between front and back, but still very good.
 

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After driving a few hundred miles in the crappy ice and snow packed roads of rural Manitoba, I have a few observations.

This AWD system behaves much smoother and better than the version that was in my 2009 Flex Limited. The Flex truly felt much more like a slip then transfer method and it was quite easy on packed snow to feel the fronts slip before the back took over some of the duties, especially in slow speed turns.

So far the transfer of power is much smoother and quicker than that in my old Flex.

Drove a rental 2017 Dodge Journey during the Christmas break and after 3500 miles to include high speed mountain driving, its AWD system is much less smooth and predictable. I would hit the accelerator to pass on packed snow roads and it would noticeably slip at the front wheels, then slam power towards the back breaking them free. Not a fun feeling when passing in the twisty mountain passing lanes.
 
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One thing that points away from a purely reactive AWD application (i.e. that torque is sent to the rear only when the front wheels experience slipping) is that it WILL oversteer under the right conditions. Turn off the traction control, head into an icy or snowy corner at low speed and hit the gas when the car is mid-turn and the back will kick out slightly.
I actually had a hard time getting it to kick out. Not to say that I couldn't get it to do some legit donuts! At least in comparison to my last car (2005 Audi A4). We are supposed to get some more snow tomorrow. Trust me, I will try again. I will say that at least the AWD is predictable!
 

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I looked into the AWD a fair bit and from my understanding it's not a slip and grip system like the halidex.
The Fusions ECU basically had a flow chart/ parameters that are required for the AWD to kick in. Slip would be one of those parameters but there are other things such as steering angle, throttle input, evasive driving, etc.
Basically it's in AWD unless you accelerate extremely lightly, or are driving down the highway in clear conditions.
It can appear that it's a slip/grip under some acceleration because the clutches still need some rotation time for the rears to start working just like when you manually click you 4x4 truck to 4 wheel drive.
The one thing I couldn't find is how much power is sent to the rear.
 

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Here's a little slow motion video I did with my 2011 Sport. I should add what I've found is that the new Sports are quicker to engage and might put more power to the rear.
 
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