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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
So a update: I got my car back today finally!!!! woohoo. So the front turbo wastegate was stuck open on my car and this is what caused my car to run like a 4 banger.....But it's all fixed now. I had to get the dealership GM involved. My Service Rep was fired and the Service Mgr had to apologize to me personally for the lack of communication and poor service and the mechanics are all getting retrained to test drive all vehicles after maint work.



But I am still figuring out a possible 3.0L swap...If I do this it will be next summer and I will have the MKZ turbos upgraded before the swap. I am looking into seeing what transmission and PTU can be swap/modified to handle all the power....the 8F57 transmission is a choice the 10 speed is also a choice but it only RWD for the 2020 Explorer ST, but I'm sure there are others but I need to really dig in to research and call around to some performance shops for guidance.
 
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I was seeing on other boards the 8F57 really might not be that much of an upgrade if at all. It would suck to drop the cash and find that out. Why not just trade in on an MKZ anyways if you are swapping all that over? All your parts would transfer right over.
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
I was seeing on other boards the 8F57 really might not be that much of an upgrade if at all. It would suck to drop the cash and find that out. Why not just trade in on an MKZ anyways if you are swapping all that over? All your parts would transfer right over.



I don't really like how how the MKZ looks..the front is not that bad, just needs a badge-less blacked out grille, but the rear...is ugly as ****. The tails lights aren't too bad but need work. I'm not a fan of the light strip across the trunk lid. The rear lower bumper cover would have to go, I don't like the look of it. Needs to be able to support exhaust like Borla (quad tip). There is no fixing that easily. Now with the interior, all that fake ABS wood trim has to go. The steering wheel isn't too bad but would have to change that out. the center console with the infotainment would get a flat panel display. ( I will be doing this to my car with the t-style (Tesla) infotainment but the OS will be the Android Automotive OS with customization). Plus for 55K thats a bit much....
 

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Discussion Starter · #24 ·
I finally got to drive around with the BBK TB in.....wow......what a difference in response. It is more responsive at the low end and screams to 60 and beyond without a care in the world. I had a Cordova TB before which felt better over the factory one but not by much. I can't wait to really open it up on a empty road. I might buy a GoDragy for Christmas.... and see how the car really is..
 

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I don't really like how how the MKZ looks..the front is not that bad, just needs a badge-less blacked out grille, but the rear...is ugly as ****. The tails lights aren't too bad but need work. I'm not a fan of the light strip across the trunk lid. The rear lower bumper cover would have to go, I don't like the look of it. Needs to be able to support exhaust like Borla (quad tip). There is no fixing that easily. Now with the interior, all that fake ABS wood trim has to go. The steering wheel isn't too bad but would have to change that out. the center console with the infotainment would get a flat panel display. ( I will be doing this to my car with the t-style (Tesla) infotainment but the OS will be the Android Automotive OS with customization). Plus for 55K thats a bit much....

Hi robhp. Just as an FYI: The wood in the MKZ (dash, doors, steering wheel etc) is real wood. Not the most important thing on your opinion list, but still a good fact to know.


Good luck.
 
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They're certainly better looking cars out there but I've always had that second to performance. Not a fan of the wood trim interiors either but luckily my drivers package 2017 has all carbon fiber inlays as part of the package. Also has the awd system from the RS( not sure what that actually gives me lol). It was about 6K more than a comparable Sport in the end (used of course) but I didn't mind paying for the extra power from the start and other interior upgrades like massaging seats and the panoramic roof.

Also seeing people swap in the turbos and dash from the MKZ pushed me a bit that way as well.



I was seeing on other boards the 8F57 really might not be that much of an upgrade if at all. It would suck to drop the cash and find that out. Why not just trade in on an MKZ anyways if you are swapping all that over? All your parts would transfer right over.



I don't really like how how the MKZ looks..the front is not that bad, just needs a badge-less blacked out grille, but the rear...is ugly as ****. The tails lights aren't too bad but need work. I'm not a fan of the light strip across the trunk lid. The rear lower bumper cover would have to go, I don't like the look of it. Needs to be able to support exhaust like Borla (quad tip). There is no fixing that easily. Now with the interior, all that fake ABS wood trim has to go. The steering wheel isn't too bad but would have to change that out. the center console with the infotainment would get a flat panel display. ( I will be doing this to my car with the t-style (Tesla) infotainment but the OS will be the Android Automotive OS with customization). Plus for 55K thats a bit much....
 

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I was seeing on other boards the 8F57 really might not be that much of an upgrade if at all. It would suck to drop the cash and find that out. Why not just trade in on an MKZ anyways if you are swapping all that over? All your parts would transfer right over.
at least 200 and upwards of 400 lbs more over Sport, especially base Sport.........
 

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But with more stock power to compensate. I think both are great cars. Just throwing the trade out there since since swapping engines, turbos and transmissions will probably get you past the cost of an MKZ especially if you aren't doing your own wrenching. Then the reliability of a one off engine swapped car.

at least 200 and upwards of 400 lbs more over Sport, especially base Sport.........
 

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Discussion Starter · #29 ·
The cost of the engine, turbos and transmission does not even come close to the cost of a MKZ (55K) I found several engines for $2000-$3000, Turbo upgrade is about $3000 from Comp-turbos, the transmissions would be the only iffy thing just depends what I find. I can do all the work myself. I just need the tools which I have found all pretty cheap. The power to weight ratio is not made by that much on the MKZ.



I don't need a "SAE Mechanic" do to anything unless I am lazy or I need a second pair of hands. The only time I might need one is for them to do the computer work, since I don't have any of the software. I have 2 Associate degree's to work on any type engine out there (reciprocating, turbine, rocket, AC/DC motors) and I can do composite work, sheet metal, cloth work. And now I am working on my Master's in Mechanical Engineering.I'm going broke before I get paid very well. (Got to spend money to make money) !!! LOL
 

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I don't usually buy cars new, in my market a used MKZ with similar miles was about 5k above a Fusion Sport. I'd never pay 55k for one of these, that's Audi RS3 money :)

I definitely wasn't trying in insinuate you can't wrench of your own stuff, that's awesome that you are comfortable doing all that. I'm in my early 40s now so I lack the patience and time these days but did my share of wrenching on mustang cobras and DSMs when I was younger




The cost of the engine, turbos and transmission does not even come close to the cost of a MKZ (55K) I found several engines for $2000-$3000, Turbo upgrade is about $3000 from Comp-turbos, the transmissions would be the only iffy thing just depends what I find. I can do all the work myself. I just need the tools which I have found all pretty cheap. The power to weight ratio is not made by that much on the MKZ.



I don't need a "SAE Mechanic" do to anything unless I am lazy or I need a second pair of hands. The only time I might need one is for them to do the computer work, since I don't have any of the software. I have 2 Associate degree's to work on any type engine out there (reciprocating, turbine, rocket, AC/DC motors) and I can do composite work, sheet metal, cloth work. And now I am working on my Master's in Mechanical Engineering.I'm going broke before I get paid very well. (Got to spend money to make money) !!! LOL
 
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Discussion Starter · #31 ·
I don't usually buy cars new, in my market a used MKZ with similar miles was about 5k above a Fusion Sport. I'd never pay 55k for one of these, that's Audi RS3 money :)

I definitely wasn't trying in insinuate you can't wrench of your own stuff, that's awesome that you are comfortable doing all that. I'm in my early 40s now so I lack the patience and time these days but did my share of wrenching on mustang cobras and DSMs when I was younger



I know you weren't. Its just a lot of these so called mechanics at the dealerships are incompetent, lazy and don't know what they are doing. Even if they are following the manual. I'm 38 and I am more then happy to turn a wrench, I had a mechanic tell me once that its OK to hear the clicking on a torque wench at least 3times!!!?!?!?!?!?! UMMM. no its not, one time and that's it..any more than that and you will lose you calibration...Besides that they should be calibrated once a year. I have very little faith for the dealerships....I take what they said with a grain of salt. The only reason I go to the dealer is that, w I know I can't fix easily and/or don't have the tools, parts, diagnostic software. Plus it's under warranty let them deal with it.
 

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But with more stock power to compensate. I think both are great cars. Just throwing the trade out there since since swapping engines, turbos and transmissions will probably get you past the cost of an MKZ especially if you aren't doing your own wrenching. Then the reliability of a one off engine swapped car.
Doesn't compensate on handling..............
 

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Seems to do just fine in the handling department with the extra weight, pulls more slightly more Gs and stops 1 foot longer than the Fusion Sport. Also real dynamic torque vectoring can't hurt.


Fusion Sport

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2017-ford-fusion-sport-with-summer-tires-tested-review

Braking, 70-0 mph: 155 ft
Roadholding, 300-ft-dia skidpad*: 0.89 g

MKZ 3.0T AWD

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2017-lincoln-mkz-30t-awd-test-review

Braking, 70-0 mph: 156 ft
Roadholding, 300-ft-dia skidpad*: 0.93 g

Doesn't compensate on handling..............
 

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I hear you, I had my SHO in to get the torque converter replaced under warranty and it took 30 days for them to even come to the conclusion that was the problem even though I mentioned it might be that when I dropped it off. Then when I picked it up it was loud as ****, turned out they left the downpipe to catback exhaust bolts loose. After that all I could think of what else was overlooked.

Had a loaded 2019 explorer as a loaner and really got used to having the sync3 and all the modern touches and it gave me the new car bug.

I know you weren't. Its just a lot of these so called mechanics at the dealerships are incompetent, lazy and don't know what they are doing. Even if they are following the manual. I'm 38 and I am more then happy to turn a wrench, I had a mechanic tell me once that its OK to hear the clicking on a torque wench at least 3times!!!?!?!?!?!?! UMMM. no its not, one time and that's it..any more than that and you will lose you calibration...Besides that they should be calibrated once a year. I have very little faith for the dealerships....I take what they said with a grain of salt. The only reason I go to the dealer is that, w I know I can't fix easily and/or don't have the tools, parts, diagnostic software. Plus it's under warranty let them deal with it.
 

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Seems to do just fine in the handling department with the extra weight, pulls more slightly more Gs and stops 1 foot longer than the Fusion Sport. Also real dynamic torque vectoring can't hurt.


Fusion Sport

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2017-ford-fusion-sport-with-summer-tires-tested-review

Braking, 70-0 mph: 155 ft
Roadholding, 300-ft-dia skidpad*: 0.89 g

MKZ 3.0T AWD

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2017-lincoln-mkz-30t-awd-test-review

Braking, 70-0 mph: 156 ft
Roadholding, 300-ft-dia skidpad*: 0.93 g
Put the best summer tire there is on any car, and you'll get high steady state cornering.
3-400 extra lbs still gets you sloppier handling, just like this quote from MKZ article points out.

"Worst of all, after cornering, the whole car wags like the tail of a Newfoundland puppy that just discovered freeze-dried chicken jerky. It then takes some time to recover its composure. And the all-wheel-drive system isn’t able to keep up, either, as the MKZ still wants to torque-steer off the road."

and

"In sum, these are summer-only sports-car tires fitted to a car tuned for all-season touring rubber. "

Even my Sport was tail wag happy and loose, compared to the 300 lb lighter 2.0 AWD Fusion
I had before this.
 

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No real way to settle this discussion, you have your priorities in performance and I have mine. We can just enjoy our respective cars. Have a good one
 

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Sorry to bump an old thread but I'm thinking of swaping the 3.0 into my '12 Fusion Sport. Not a fan of the larger displacement in the car due to the absolute ZERO amount of room to work on the engine xD. Keeping the transmission of the Sport and putting a low mileage 3.0l V6 in and throw on a turbo should get me the 400hp these new Fords are getting. N/A 3.5l in a 3500lb car and it only gets ~25hp more than the 3.0l. Too much low end torque is killing my front tires as well lol.
 

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Are you talking about a 3.0EB swap? The 3.EB may be smaller displacement, but the whole package is a mess with wiring, piping, and hoses. Keep the Duratec35 if you're at all worried about room. And the 2.7/3.0 EB engines have way more torque than the 3.5 NA so you'll really suffer with FWD.

If you're referring to a Duratec 3.0, you may find better info 1G / 1.5G Fusion forums to be honest. My two cents tho - if you are aiming for 400HP out of a Duratec30 you're probably going to want to do some work to beef up the internals (on top of the engine swap) for a negligible difference in block size, while the Duratec35 that you already have is already much closer to your target. If you REALLY want to swap something else, the 3.7L would be sweet in a '12 Sport. Same engine as the 3.5 so won't be too messy, either.
 
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