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Discussion Starter #1
Was reading through some magazines (im like 6 months to a year behind) and in the "new for 2017" section i found data on the lil a4. Its a 2.0 turbo 4 cyl, 250hp 270tq awd. So first glance our cars are simmilar but the fusion has the audi whooped in power department. Right? Well the drag race would be a close one... 13.8 ish for the audi. Low 5 sec 0to60! Im not gunna quote all the lil details, but i have driven the a4 and its "software" is much more aggressive and responsive compared to our fusions. Hard to say power wise if audi is seriously under rating or what... but it goes when ya push the gas!

Any thought?

Anyone else test drive a new a4?



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That's the thing about the Fusion compared to the German's... BMW and Audi use some really good gearing, which is why they're so quick with less power. They're not light cars, either. I feel like Ford could do much better if they put a little more money into figuring out the transmission gears, but then it would probably beat Mustangs, and that's a no-no at Ford.

Audi's do have a lot more "aggressive" tuning as well.
 

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Ford announced they are moving something like 7 billion dollars from car to truck development. I doubt there will be anything new and exciting coming from their cars for a while unless it is passed over from the trucks.

Not to mention what it will do for their already shaky reliability...
 

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The transmission is a huge weak link in this car. Its so antiquated compared to many manufactures, not just Germans! Gearing, shift quality, shift speed, proper gear selection.... uhg. And even if audis acceloration was all gearing it be screaming on the highway.... gettinf bad mileage. So i dont think its all gearing related.

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No it's definitely not all gearing related, but that is a big part of the equation. My buddy is a VW/Audi guy, so I've gotten some experience with them. The Germans do a lot of things differently, and they do cost more.

Remember, a basic tune that gets rid of the torque limiting in the first couple gears help a lot on its own in the early stages of tunes for these cars.

The Germans do (usually) make a car as good, sporty, and fast as they see ideal. Ford made the Sport to be quick while keeping in mind they have a new RS, the STs, and the Mustang under "Ford Performance"... Their biggest selling fmaily sedan can't be faster than those! The Fusion Sport was never meant to be a sports car (despite Ford's early advertising), and that goes for the 6F55 transmission as well. They're great, but their primary intentions are not being sporty.

So, there's a lot of factors. As we see constantly on these forums, there's A LOT holding our cars back.

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Discussion Starter #7
Yes i agree but it doesnt necessarily need to be a rocket and faster then the rs and st and mustangs. It can be just as fast as it is now, but with better software and a better transmission! It would make the car a ton better to drive!

I just thought it was interesting seeing and comparing specs. Funny enough the chevy version of the audi. Cadillac 2.0 rwd something or other... was much much slower. Like 15 sec 1/4!! Sorry dont have magazine in front of me.

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I totally agree that Ford should've/could've made the Sport with a much better transmission (programming mostly).

But the simple fact is that we have an awesome "sleeper" sedan, capable of high 12 second 1/4 mile times (with a tune) for a very reasonable price. Though the car is far from perfect, it is a tremendous performance value.

Just my opinion...
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I totally agree that Ford should've/could've made the Sport with a much better transmission (programming mostly).

But the simple fact is that we have an awesome "sleeper" sedan, capable of high 12 second 1/4 mile times (with a tune) for a very reasonable price. Though the car is far from perfect, it is a tremendous performance value.

Just my opinion...
Im not arguing that! I just see how much better it coulda been! But if you look strickly at 1/4 mile times. The car isnt that great.... at least i dont think so. But when you look at the whole package. Seats are pretty nice, interior in general is great... although on cheaper side, sound system is very adequate, ride is fantastic! One of the best if driven recently, its quiet. Aaaaand its fast. To me... if you look only at performance, spec wise its alright only.

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Now that I'll completely agree with. Personally, the overall package is what makes me love this car. If a Focus or WRX performed the same as this car, I think I'd be upset. But the other aspects of it make it a **** good car to own.

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Ford made the Sport to be quick while keeping in mind they have a new RS, the STs, and the Mustang under "Ford Performance"... Their biggest selling fmaily sedan can't be faster than those!
See, this is where I disagree. IMO, if that is Ford's thinking, they are missing out on a whole nother market and need to fire their marketing director! You think Audi has 5 sport sedans and coupes (not counting sub-trims) that hover in the same area because they are worried that the S3 is going to cannibalize sales of the S4 and S5? No, they understand sub-markets! A true Mustang or RS buyer is never even going to look at a Fusion Sport, no matter how good it is and the reverse...

A buddy just got a brand new 17 A4 Quattro, so we will have to do some "independent testing" ;)
 

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Discussion Starter #12
See, this is where I disagree. IMO, if that is Ford's thinking, they are missing out on a whole nother market and need to fire their marketing director! You think Audi has 5 sport sedans and coupes (not counting sub-trims) that hover in the same area because they are worried that the S3 is going to cannibalize sales of the S4 and S5? No, they understand sub-markets! A true Mustang or RS buyer is never even going to look at a Fusion Sport, no matter how good it is and the reverse...

A buddy just got a brand new 17 A4 Quattro, so we will have to do some "independent testing" ;)
Im down to see some test results! Just make sure its a quattro! They do sell a fwd one with a different engine with much less power!

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Im down to see some test results! Just make sure its a quattro! They do sell a fwd one with a different engine with much less power!

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I'm down with it too if I'm allowed to put 8-10 grand of mods
in my fusion first. Otherwise, huge apples to orange comparison
in $ spent. Of course more $ almost always wins.

I priced out one of those audi's trying to get as close as I could
to my fusion and it was 45K. Found lowest price for that on
autotrader (nationwide) was 40K.
 

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I'm down with it too if I'm allowed to put 8-10 grand of mods
in my fusion first. Otherwise, huge apples to orange comparison
in $ spent. Of course more $ almost always wins.

I priced out one of those audi's trying to get as close as I could
to my fusion and it was 45K. Found lowest price for that on
autotrader (nationwide) was 40K.
LOL. Definitely have a point there! I just priced out roughly what he told me he got and it was about $44k. Not sure if he leased or financed, but I am still stock, so it would definitely be a "stock to stock" matchup.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I'm down with it too if I'm allowed to put 8-10 grand of mods
in my fusion first. Otherwise, huge apples to orange comparison
in $ spent. Of course more $ almost always wins.

I priced out one of those audi's trying to get as close as I could
to my fusion and it was 45K. Found lowest price for that on
autotrader (nationwide) was 40K.
Whoa man! Hold the brakes! I never mentioned anything about price.... i was just asking if the lil 4cly was sandbagging and if anyone had driven one. Cause realistically if you want to compar these cars... yes, our cars are a great "deal" BUT, the audi has better interior, better chassis (although ours rides better), better transmission, better user interface, engine and trans software far beyond our cars... And the biggest thing our fords are missing. Well one of three : 4 rings. A star. Or a circle but has BMW in center.

This was not a comparison as much as it was just to see if anyonw has driven both and noticed what i origonally mentioned.

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Whoa man! Hold the brakes! I never mentioned anything about price.... i was just asking if the lil 4cly was sandbagging and if anyone had driven one. Cause realistically if you want to compar these cars... yes, our cars are a great "deal" BUT, the audi has better interior, better chassis (although ours rides better), better transmission, better user interface, engine and trans software far beyond our cars... And the biggest thing our fords are missing. Well one of three : 4 rings. A star. Or a circle but has BMW in center.

This was not a comparison as much as it was just to see if anyonw has driven both and noticed what i origonally mentioned.

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Of course they have more efficient trans's and usually better torque curves,
but that is what happens when you design cars to sell @ $10-30K more
than what ford offers (comparably).

I have zero issues with the interior or "user interface" (whatever that
really means). The extra flash on the more expensive cars
is typically stuff that is just annoying these days.

I had a loner MKX and that thing had all kinds of annoying quirks
solely to due enhanced "user interface".

I just love all these new cars that right in the middle of the dash, at
the right angle in the sun, looks like two 3 year olds just ate jello and then
decided to try using your touch screen. NOT!!!
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Of course they have more efficient trans's and usually better torque curves,
but that is what happens when you design cars to sell @ $10-30K more
than what ford offers (comparably).

I have zero issues with the interior or "user interface" (whatever that
really means). The extra flash on the more expensive cars
is typically stuff that is just annoying these days.

I had a loner MKX and that thing had all kinds of annoying quirks
solely to due enhanced "user interface".

I just love all these new cars that right in the middle of the dash, at
the right angle in the sun, looks like two 3 year olds just ate jello and then
decided to try using your touch screen. NOT!!!
Ok then we agree that a 4 cyl that has less power by a good margin..... is just as fast as our cars!?

The user interface could be so much better.... i have the 2 screens on my cluster ( dont know which model you have) but there is a ton of neat features build in. Just organized horribly, like 3 engineers under the age of 13 argued who was right... they couldnt agree so they all juat did what they wanted. The left screen does way to much and the right does basically nothing. The touch screen (i have the Sony, once again yours may be different) also could be so much better! No way to easilly change a/c vent "outlet" no way to easilly change from am to fm to xm. Gotta click audio, then source, then pick which one... i feel like eveeything in the car takes to many steps. And while im talking about selecting stuff... the buttons on the steering wheel are crooked and shaped goofy, constantly hittinf right and up or left and down or the wrong one cause they are at and angle.

And im not sure what you meant by the jello comment.......... but i in general dont like touch screens you have to takw your eyes off the road to select spmething because there is no tactile feel to a button on a flat screen.

Lastly. I just want ya to know i really like this car, the audi i wanted a6 3.0 supercharged was almost 600 a month and my fusion is 460 (equal down payments and upside down rollover from previous kia lease). The fusion has same size interior, same power (on paper) rides better! And looks nice to boot! No prestige in having 4 rings but i dont really care about that.

So im not trying to agrue with ya! We fusion sport friends!

Josh

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Ok then we agree that a 4 cyl that has less power by a good margin..... is just as fast as our cars!?

The user interface could be so much better.... i have the 2 screens on my cluster ( dont know which model you have) but there is a ton of neat features build in. Just organized horribly, like 3 engineers under the age of 13 argued who was right... they couldnt agree so they all juat did what they wanted. The left screen does way to much and the right does basically nothing. The touch screen (i have the Sony, once again yours may be different) also could be so much better! No way to easilly change a/c vent "outlet" no way to easilly change from am to fm to xm. Gotta click audio, then source, then pick which one... i feel like eveeything in the car takes to many steps. And while im talking about selecting stuff... the buttons on the steering wheel are crooked and shaped goofy, constantly hittinf right and up or left and down or the wrong one cause they are at and angle.

And im not sure what you meant by the jello comment.......... but i in general dont like touch screens you have to takw your eyes off the road to select spmething because there is no tactile feel to a button on a flat screen.

Lastly. I just want ya to know i really like this car, the audi i wanted a6 3.0 supercharged was almost 600 a month and my fusion is 460 (equal down payments and upside down rollover from previous kia lease). The fusion has same size interior, same power (on paper) rides better! And looks nice to boot! No prestige in having 4 rings but i dont really care about that.

So im not trying to agrue with ya! We fusion sport friends!

Josh

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"Has less power by a good margin" is relative. Germans underrate almost everything and that car is 500 lbs lighter. Also has one more cog on the trans.

2017 Ford Fusion Sport EcoBoost AWD First Test - Motor Trend
https://www.autoblog.com/buy/2017-Audi-A4-2.0T_Premium__4dr_All_wheel_Drive_quattro_Sedan/specs/

Audi/BMW do manage to get a killer low torque peak, very
good job for them, but again it costs money

I bought the base model, no issues with user interface.
it has buttons, no touch screen. I hate those things too.
Only thing I miss (slightly) is FORscan programming of CCD
and easier ability to add sub with 401a.

No worries, just a discussion. :D
 

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Discussion Starter #19
"Has less power by a good margin" is relative. Germans underrate almost everything and that car is 500 lbs lighter. Also has one more cog on the trans.

2017 Ford Fusion Sport EcoBoost AWD First Test - Motor Trend
https://www.autoblog.com/buy/2017-Audi-A4-2.0T_Premium__4dr_All_wheel_Drive_quattro_Sedan/specs/

Audi/BMW do manage to get a killer low torque peak, very
good job for them, but again it costs money

I bought the base model, no issues with user interface.
it has buttons, no touch screen. I hate those things too.
Only thing I miss (slightly) is FORscan programming of CCD
and easier ability to add sub with 401a.

No worries, just a discussion. :D
And thats what i was saying! Is the lil 2.0 sandbagging big time or are our cars just not that great a combo.... consitering on paper it seems to be great!

Well imagine your cluster, it Now has 2 screens but the left one does everything and it seems all jumbled and out or order. And the righr one kinda sorta does stuff but nothing very well. And then you now have a touch screen! Everything is a sub menue. Very little on each screen does very much. You HAVE TO go into a sub to do everything! So theres that.

I just wanted the better stereo. Unfortunatly it came with touch screne and nav! But i do like the backup camera and cooled seats!

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And thats what i was saying! Is the lil 2.0 sandbagging big time or are our cars just not that great a combo.... consitering on paper it seems to be great!
Yes, the Germans typically "sandbag"

but I can't see making statements about the Sport
combo not being great, until you show me something
even close for the price.

If we are not considering price, then why not just
compare it to a 90D.................
 
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